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Cybercod
wrote on the 13 Mar 08 at 05:14
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What are you proposing? a small bootable utility? or do you expect the Ubuntu guys to program a windows app?
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daengbo
wrote on the 13 Mar 08 at 05:27
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Java would probably be good for this, since it works just about everywhere. Download the applet and get a report.
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XSP
wrote on the 13 Mar 08 at 06:20
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Yeah. You mention to do this all before running the LiveCD, so I am assuming you're talking about a Windows or Mac application.
What's wrong with all the websites that are devoted to listing the hardware supported in Linux?
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DPic
wrote on the 13 Mar 08 at 07:10
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Like i said, people are lazy. Do we want to make people go look through websites to find all of their hardware and make sure it works? People want to be able to find out what works, and what doesn't, and they don't want to have to go and investigate for themselves.
I'm proposing we do this in a way which makes the most sense. Java doesn't sound like a bad idea
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In my experience most average computer users DON'T KNOW WHAT HARDWARE THEY HAVE. So a list of what graphics cards are supported is of little help to them.
I think some application for Windows that scans their hardware and gives a report is a good idea. Ubuntu has Wubi now, so it's not like a Windows app has never been made relating to Ubuntu.
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zoubidoo
wrote on the 13 Mar 08 at 11:44
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How about running the app just once, which collects hardware data and uploads it to ubuntu. Then receive an email when the hardware is 100% compatible.
This avoids testing multiple times - useful if the hardware is at family/friends place.
http://brainstorm.ubuntu.com/idea/3471/
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I would recommend against this solution.
It's very nice in theory, but making it work on Windows means a lot of effort, and that effort won't be useful if you aren't running Windows for whatever reason.
I think the LiveCD should come with a hardware checklist. In other words, a list of hardware features, and a test for each. So you can run through the list and check whether you have 3D acceleration, sound, correct resolution graphics, standby/suspend to ram, or whatever else you're interested in.
Scanning for hardware would obviously be very useful for such a checklist, so it could automatically give you a list of what it thinks your hardware can do, and whether Ubuntu can use it. But there are obscure things e.g. support for authentication on wired networks which Ubuntu doesn't support out of the box (not without editting config files), where the user may not realise that it would be a problem, and they would only find out by trying to connect to the internet using a LiveCD.
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spyyder
wrote on the 13 Mar 08 at 19:56
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Uh, just make it part of the live CD. Make it one the the selections in the boot menu. Query an online database and submitted hardware profles and provide an analysis. It could be web based too.
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DPic
wrote on the 14 Mar 08 at 01:17
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"It's very nice in theory, but making it work on Windows means a lot of effort, and that effort won't be useful if you aren't running Windows for whatever reason."
This is aimed at people running other OSes....
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madjr
wrote on the 14 Mar 08 at 05:06
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quote
>"How about running the app just once, which collects hardware data and uploads it to ubuntu. Then receive an email when the hardware is 100% compatible."
i disagree with the email thing, people should get a list of hardware they can buy that works now!, not wait millions of years till their winmodem works....
an ubuntu compatible store is what i propose:
http://brainstorm.ubuntu.com/idea/3575/
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ayeomans
wrote on the 14 Mar 08 at 10:16
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Current hardware compatibility sites never seem to give definitive answers on whether h/w works with any particular flavour of Linux. Or even a definitive list of what the kernel.org sources actually support. The best to date is arguably the Knoppix hardware detection routine.
So having a utility which scans the hardware, says "this is what I think you have" (can't be sure due to a few vendors mixing up ID numbers) and "this is what I support" would be great. Even better if there was some way of adding "not supported out the box but some reports of getting it to work".
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ayeomans
wrote on the 14 Mar 08 at 10:21
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A related utility would take the wealth of data in /lib/modules/* and process it to get the definitive list of supported hardware. Such large lists would help overcome the myth that much hardware is not supported.
Maybe, if it isn't already there, we need an "unsupported hardware" driver so at least such unsupported hardware gets explicitly recognised and flagged. Saves wasting time.
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This would be very welcome when I'm in a computer store where the sales representative - strangely - doesn't allow me to run LiveCDs on 'his' hardware on display. Worse, a lot of sales people in computer stores simply don't even exactly know what they are selling.
But what they just might allow is an online java tool that would check compatibility without having to open the CD drive. Thus, people can safely buy a "ubuntu ready" desktop.
And: sales people would become more and more interested in selling Ubuntu computers. In the end, they might even advise Ubuntu.
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zoubidoo
wrote on the 16 Mar 08 at 18:48
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@madjr
With all due respect, I think you are completely wrong to exclude people who don't go out and buy ubuntu-ready hardware. Many people already have bought hardware.
We want to include anyone who is prepared to give ubuntu a try, and letting them know that their hardware is compatible is a great way to give them a good first experience.
Your "us versus them" attitude really isn't helpful.
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maybe something similar to the "checkupgradeonly" switch for windows?
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srul89
wrote on the 30 Apr 08 at 08:16
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I agree with the concept of having a hardware compatibility tester tool.I have seen one for Solaris OS.
If similar is available for Ubuntu the it will be good to know in advance for hardware compatibility issues,problems of not having drivers and so many,prior to installation.
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Fully agree.
My experience with the live installer -- the isntaller treats you like a no-nothing until its too late. This issue is less with the text based installer (it tells you more what it is doing and erros / issues on the way). The live installer just tells you that it is installing (little more).
For instance with my last installation with 8.04 (due to new main disk) -- wireless was deprecated from normal speed to 1 Mb/s -- why? hardware / driver recognition issue -- was working fine with 7.10. graphic adapter was not recognised and is a clunky vesa/vga or wahtever withs lots of issues and poor performance.
If instalations would start by saying -- this is your list of hw, for this and that there is no support but there are workarounds, try manual alternatives, etc, and then -- proceed or keep your system as is. Information from instalation could then be fed-back to a database of issues.
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Thinking about BBirdtree's idea... the "there are workarounds" option...
How about where these workarounds are known at release time, they are packaged up as -meta scripts and put on the CD? That way, you could have the following process flow..
User slips CD in drive, either boots from it or launches some kind of Wubi-like interface.
"Check hardware" option is offered (or mandatory); this tests not just against the current release, but the last one.
Hardware checker goes into action, testing models and running checks.. reporting back status. Make it nice and graphical - maybe like the Y2K testers that were common in the Wintel world, or like the System Mechanic-type apps that are in that industry.
Outputs something like...
Processor... i686 dual core... FULLY SUPPORTED
Memory.... ... FULLY SUPPORTED
(runs lspci)
Display controller.... ... GOOD/WARNING/UNSUPPORTED"
Big, bold and obvious... Red, amber, green. Windows end-users are used to this... think of the AV products out there.
Make the obvious checks first - display, input devices, Ethernet/Wireless. From here, this could feed into the installer, so correct packages are collected..
AMBER under Ethernet could mean that the installer prompts for a Windows driver, and tries to bring the interface up under ndiswrapper (but scripted)... or using Wubi might mean that the Windows filesystem and Registry could be checked for make/model/components.
In effect, two modes would be needed. One for bare-bones, running off a CD, and the other would be a Wintel app; info could be written to a USB stick or ramdisk before the actual install..
Thoughts?
Macs are probably easier, as there are fewer variants.
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Blueprint hardware-compatibility-tester:
