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Description
Hide vote count while idea is still new to eliminate the vote count influence.
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unimatrix wrote on the 31 May 08 at 15:09
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How about maybe "Hide until you vote"
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jhoger wrote on the 31 May 08 at 16:39
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I think it is a good idea, but needs to go a long with showing "Latest Ideas" on the default BS homepage. Otherwise, how would you order the ideas?
Maybe the vote count is hidden for a day?
Note that this would increase the leverage of commenters, since with no vote count being shown, all that is left is the opinions of those interested enough to comment.
I think that's better since analysis is provided in the comments, but I am pretty sure most BS'ers wouldn't agree with me.
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JohnSearle wrote on the 31 May 08 at 17:57
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I agree with Unimatrix. Voting for the idea regardless, though.
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jhoger wrote on the 31 May 08 at 19:53
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FWIW, I find unimatrix's description less clear. In any event, the Idea cannot be changed once submitted.
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unimatrix wrote on the 31 May 08 at 20:43
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@jhoger: If I had a clear vision about this I'd submit my own idea ;)
I see your point though. Any type of hiding would be completely meaningless if they were ever to implement vote changing. Some may just vote anything and then change it according to the trend.
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unimatrix wrote on the 31 May 08 at 20:51
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In addition to my previous post:
Maybe there could be like a 1 hour (or more) delay until you could change the vote. If someone REALLY needed to change their vote they still could, but everyone would still vote according to what they think instead of what everyone else thinks.
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flammon wrote on the 31 May 08 at 20:58
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Maybe we need a maturing period, like 2 weeks, to give people time to post comments, debate and influence each other before voting.
Regarding the ability to change votes, please have a look at may other idea. http://brainstorm.ubuntu.com/idea/9299/
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unimatrix wrote on the 31 May 08 at 21:08
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@flammon: Seen your idea. Didn't like it. Too limiting.
And what the hell do you mean a 2 weeks maturing period for posting comments, are you nuts? For your information, one of the purposes of comments is also to influence others, because people may write VALID points about ideas. Comments are completely fine. The only problem is trend voting.
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flammon wrote on the 31 May 08 at 22:19
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@unimatrix: I don't think you got me because I'm very pro comment. The purpose of the maturing period is specifically to encourage people to post comments, debate and discuss before they vote.
- Comments in its current form can only influence _future_ voters. Don't bother trying to change the minds of the 1000 who already voted because they can't do anything about their vote. Even if the idea turns out to be a bad one.
- If a better but competing idea comes up later, you can't retract your vote from the lesser idea and vote for the better one. You are currently left with the option to vote for both ideas. Basically you're forced to contradict yourself.
- No matter what I say in this comment, you currently can't change your vote. How do you feel about that? Limited maybe?
See, you convinced me that 2 weeks is probably too long. So what do you suggest for a discussion period?
That's what these comments should do, refine and foster new ideas. The problem is, you can't really vote for all the ideas as they get better and refined because voting for all the ideas is as useless as not voting at all.
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unimatrix wrote on the 31 May 08 at 23:55
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Don't know about you, but If I'm not sure about how to vote I usually read the comments. If there aren't enough I can wait. Don't see anything wrong with this. And besides, we should be discussing Vote result hiding here. Please write according to topic. I will not reply to this offtopic anymore. Send me a personal message when they implement them ;)
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glibik wrote on the 1 Jun 08 at 01:52
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I find it difficult to comprehend that people are sufficiently weak minded that such a thing as "vote count influence" really exists.
Vote = -1
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gazilla wrote on the 1 Jun 08 at 02:57
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I think that flammon is just pissed that he/she put up an idea (9299-Brainstorm Bucks) and it got jumped on in the first few minutes. I watched it happen, and for the record you got a -1 from me. But each of these voters control just one vote, by definition, and I agree with glibik that "vote count influence" plays no part it the process. I/We/they just didn't like your idea. Don't like this one either, sorry. -1
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jhoger wrote on the 1 Jun 08 at 04:43
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Huh? Is anyone seriously arguing that vote count does not influence future votes? "Weak minded?" Sheesh.
How about we try to make these discussions less vitriolic and personal? Reasoned opinions are much more productive.
But anyway, the votes count affects the sort order. Higher voted items float to the top. Viewers that just browse to the main page may not scroll through all of the days ideas. So the first items in the sort order will get more votes.
So early votes influence later votes.
I think this could largely be dealt with by showing Latest Ideas on the home page and sorting by order of submission. You still get the problem of some someone dumping a whole bunch of little ideas at once and hiding your idea, but I think this would on the whole be a better thing.
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Craig73 wrote on the 25 Jun 08 at 16:23
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I don't know - the vote count doesn't influence my vote but it does influence which ideas get seen... I don't have time to scroll through so many duplicate ideas.
If the new ideas view could be sorted by 'most active' (those with the most total votes regardless) this would time for those less invested in reading everything and just want to comment on the most debated ideas.
Then go ahead and hide the vote. Actually I think it might be a good idea... if only until I have voted.
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glibik wrote on the 2 Jul 08 at 04:39
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Maybe, jhoger, I'm a little different from most, but an existing vote count doesn't hold any sway with me.
In the case of Brainstorm, I just look at the idea, how sensible / silly / reasoned / applicable / etc. it is. Then, depending on how those things gel with my opinions / morals / ethics / standards, I'll choose to vote it up or down, or possibly not vote on it at all.
As far as sorting ideas is concerned, my Brainstorm bookmark** is: http://brainstorm.ubuntu.com/latest_ideas/ That probably makes me a little different from most as well.
** Geez that term annoys me. What's wrong with calling it a "saved URL"? Rhetorical question, please don't try to answer.
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