Idea #6474: Don't just overwrite the Windows Bootloader, without even asking or notifying

Written by sf_007 the 6 Apr 08 at 00:20. Category: Installation.
Related to: Nothing/Others. Status: New

Description

If a user installs ubuntu on the same HDD as windows (on a different partition) GRUB replaces the windows bootloader without warning... not vey nice...

Most people don't just switch completly from windows to Linux in one day, they first may use the Live CD, maybe install on a partition they have on the Windows PC... everything is fun and games.... but while the user doesn't get acquainted with Linux thay may need/decide to format the partition where Linux is installed (formatting is also the easiest way to remove Linux) and thats when the problems start:
Windows does not boot... people curse Linux and swear never again to touch such a dangerous software... not good!

How about something like this:

#################################################
A partition with windows has been detected.
[X] Add an entry for ubuntu on the windows bootloader (recommended)
[ ] Install GRUB and let it manage the booting of all detected systems? (will replace the current bootloader)
#################################################

OR

#################################################
GRUB will be installed and from now on it will manage the booting of all the detected Operating Systems.

[OK/NEXT] [MORE OPTIONS]
################################################

For Linux users, (no windows detected) things would not change a bit...
This are just examples, the only thing important is that it should "play nicer" with windows users....

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Comments

kumailht wrote on the 6 Apr 08 at 03:49

totally agree

aysiu wrote on the 6 Apr 08 at 03:52

Too complicated. As you said before, people migrate in stages. I'd recommend the live CD, VirtualBox, even Wubi, before a traditional installation. By the time they commit to a dual-boot installation, they should know it's a commitment.

jojoman02 wrote on the 6 Apr 08 at 04:38

Totally useless and windows does the same thing (replaces w/o asking), but unlike windows when another OS is installed it is included in grub. Also why would windows boot loader be recommended over grub (it is far inferior). Third point is you can't even have ubuntu load thru the windows boot loader AFAIK due to limitations in the windows boot loader.

-1 from me.

P.S. there is an option not to install grub in the installation but you have to look for it.

Niedzwiedz wrote on the 6 Apr 08 at 08:15

IMO there should by question
Boot by default:
[X] Ubuntu Linux
[] Other installed Linux (ie openSUSE Linux)
[] Microsoft Windows

holizz wrote on the 6 Apr 08 at 08:18

As I recall it tells you that GRUB is going to be installed, and you have the option to stop it from being installed.

sf_007 wrote on the 6 Apr 08 at 13:17

@jojoman02
Just because windows is unfriendly to other OSes, Linux should be too?
Windows bootloader can easily boot ubuntu, I do it all the time... GRUB just has to be installed in the ubuntu partition and then "just" add and entry for ubuntu on windows bootloader.

sf_007 wrote on the 6 Apr 08 at 13:23

Sure, we may have an option not to install GRUB, but whats the point of that? that way ubuntu will not load, only useful for "techies"... most people will have problems with that...
Besides, it's very easy to break an ubuntu system... for a newbie... I know because I did it all the time...

sf_007 wrote on the 6 Apr 08 at 14:12

@aysiu
Live CDs are slow and it's only like a "demo"... most people don't even know what a "Virtual Machine" is... wubi is good, but not as good as a "real" ubuntu installation.
A real installation should not mean a "commitment"! people hate commitments, "just because I install ubuntu that means I have to stick with it?!? Hell no!" Thats what most people will think... That's why many people are always afraid of Linux: if someone installs it, they can't just format its partition and remove it because it will break their system! I think this is a terrible thing...
Some time ago I installed Mac OS X Leopard on my "x86" laptop, does that means it was a commitment? no way! Soon after, it was screwed and I just formated the partition...
For windows users I think it was better to use the windows bootloader, for a newcomer to Linux, a GRUB and an Ubuntu installation are very easy to "screw up"...

joeally wrote on the 6 Apr 08 at 17:27

you cant select linux from the windows boot loader. -1

Wouter.de.Groot wrote on the 6 Apr 08 at 19:15

If you install Ubuntu Windows won't know about it. I myself have no idea how to edit a Windows bootloader, and I do not want to invest anymore time in that OS. Only reason I have it around is for the occasional gaming bout.

Ubiquity should be a decent installer and offer to modify an existing bootloader or something --something more flexible than install/don't install. That rubbish of 'by the time users are installing they know what they're doing' is counterintuitive to Ubuntu's mission, I'd say.

zooounds wrote on the 6 Apr 08 at 20:12

Removing the Windows bootloader should be recommended. -1

loonyphoenix wrote on the 6 Apr 08 at 22:27

I'm amazed at the misconception that you can't boot linux with Windows bootloader. And what's so great about grub anyway? Sure, it's needed to load linux, but the OS chooser is a straightforward thing which can't be better or worse either way. I say let the user decide. How hard is it to write grub to the ubuntu partion and add an entrance to Windows's boot.ini?

Sorry if the html tags above didn't work. It's my first time trying it.

loonyphoenix wrote on the 6 Apr 08 at 22:27

They worked! Hehe.

sf_007 wrote on the 6 Apr 08 at 23:17

@joeally
Yes you can, I do it all the time

sf_007 wrote on the 6 Apr 08 at 23:27

@zooounds
"Removing the Windows bootloader should be recommended"

GRUB is much easier to screw up than the windows bootloader, at least in my experience... so why not give the user the choice? Thats the only thing I'm suggesting: give us the choice!

sf_007 wrote on the 6 Apr 08 at 23:31

@Wouter.de.Groot
That's exactly my point.

sf_007 wrote on the 6 Apr 08 at 23:41

@loonyphoenix
Exactly, and even adding an entry to the bootloader of Windows Vista isn't that hard...

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