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egroj
wrote on the 5 Mar 08 at 16:17
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Better yet, with country selection change all those settings.
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roazena
wrote on the 5 Mar 08 at 16:18
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Until Feisty or Gutsy, the first thing I had to do EVERY TIME post-install was undo A4 paper in CUPS and the GB language pack extension in Firefox.
I had thought the change in recent versions was due to install-time detection of country via timezone settings.
A better idea would be Ubuntu asking (like every other OS) which country you're in and using the same localization routines that determine numbering separator characters, currency symbol, etc. to choose a default paper type.
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ll
wrote on the 5 Mar 08 at 16:22
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I'm anti-imperial and would normally say get rid of all imperial support but since this is Linux we are talking about I realize I have to let it stay in the spirit of freedom to customize your system.
Note: I live in USA and I want my computer to use the metric system so please no US Americans saying this is a conspiracy against USA.
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I agree that during the install it should just ask you what country you are in and set the defaults that way. Or even just ask what units you would prefer.
I like metric units more, but I would rather not have to go in and change all the settings. So how about one of the two I just said?
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ll
wrote on the 5 Mar 08 at 16:54
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I would be happy if the installer asked me what country I was in and showed me all the country specific options in the next screen. The most used options should be selected for the specific country but you would be able to change the settings either selecting them from a list or drop down menu.
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centx
wrote on the 5 Mar 08 at 17:03
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It would be nice if this could be based on the country chosen by the user.
Pretty please though, ask user what language the system should use by default, I don not want my local language, but English, without the inches n' rubbish.
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muecker
wrote on the 5 Mar 08 at 17:22
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There definitely needs to be a setting if this is implemented. I live in the US and work in inches so I don't want my computer to turn metric. Its already bad enough that Evolution wants to print everything in A4 without giving me the option of changing it.
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csulok
wrote on the 5 Mar 08 at 17:46
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you are asked of your location when installing.
if (location == usa or location == burma/myanmar or location == liberia) default = imperial
else default = metric
pretty please.
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Yeah, I was definitely asked to specify my location, language and keyboard settings when I installed.
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spyyder
wrote on the 5 Mar 08 at 18:16
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An option to choose would be best.
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spyyder:
Agreeing with all the people who say that you should be able to choose during installation. Two little check boxes to decide the measurement system next to where you choose your language would be nice; however, don't Make it based on country, as someone may be in the US and want to use metric.
This would not be very hard to implement.
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Afaik, during the install you select your location on a world map for the time zone. Doesn't that also arrange your local settings (paper size, language, measure units, date format)?
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asdf46
wrote on the 5 Mar 08 at 19:28
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Can this post be changed to include the intelligent switching that everyone wants based off the localization? I'd vote it up if it had that in the description. :)
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deadowl
wrote on the 5 Mar 08 at 19:36
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I have a phobia of conversion factors.
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Good idea. However more important is maybe that the chosen system (or in your case paper format) is used more consequently. I'd like to choose for metric once and have EVERY application and printer use A4 instead of letter. Now I still have to set it manually for some applications, set my environment (LC_PAPER) for some other applications, etc.
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nvivo
wrote on the 5 Mar 08 at 20:48
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Can't this be like in Windows? The default is choosen by language, but each setting like measurement, date, etc can be configured individually.
Actually, I think KDE has a similar settings screen.
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ll
wrote on the 5 Mar 08 at 20:51
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I have made a screen shot of what I think should be included in the installer right after you select your location. It is incomplete and very bad graphically but I hope it shows that these things should be customizable in the installer. Along with the measuring units, paper size, and how the date is displayed a few more things could be included.
http://lklk.awardspace.com/ubuntu.html
Feel free to modify the screen shot.
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Yes Country based selection is a good idea..
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There are too many people in the US to make Metric default, but like what everyone else said, they should make it a choice during Installation.
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I agree, country selection during the installation should determine these settings.
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I'm in the US I still have apps that default to A4 on every new doc and it's annoying as $%^@. (Inkscape - are you listening?)
I would be happy if you just had to specify ONCE and every other app would default to this. Of course, this is probably not Ubuntu's fault since they don't by any stretch control the way other apps set up their docs.
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^ Right, but if there was the possibility to set a system-wide default in Ubuntu, then other applications could, as they are developed, accommodate that.
Country-based selection would be a good starting place, but speaking as someone from a (theoretically) imperial country, I would need the option to change it myself, because I personally only use metric.
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Bram S
wrote on the 6 Mar 08 at 09:24
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Great idea, as long as this means we also use the proper notation for bits and bytes in all of the OS. 1 MiB = 1024 KiB = 1048576 Bytes
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manish
wrote on the 6 Mar 08 at 09:33
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There is another way.
Give a selection drop down menu for metric and imperial units.
When user selects metric, the value shows in metric when he selects imperial, show it in that units...
You can use a global option for it or local options for each dialog box.
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pilat
wrote on the 6 Mar 08 at 12:21
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Well, I'm from a country, where metric system is common. But I would think seven times, before giving Green lite to this idea. Especially, if to talk about inches vs. meters.
Some known facts:
1. none or very few hardware manufacturers would write "0.64 meter monitor" or "0.0889 meter hard-drive"..
2. almost all web/printed documents-designers use inches and their natural fractions for font sizes and etc.
3. ... think on some other examples yourself
;-)
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I can so far report that on MY computersystems, everything automatically installed in metric. When cosing German or French language, everything comes up the right way.
@ pilat: EVERYBODY is selling 36cm, 55cm or 80cm screens here. Pretty much noone really advertises a 14, 22 or 32 inch TV. Inches are a common in the computer world, but even there it's getting old (15,4" Notebook screen is in fact 39cm).
pt and ppi (pix per inch) are based on imperial values - and I got used to them - but really NOBODY uses imperial paper sizes for printing etc - that's the A4, A5 etc from bottom to top everywhere.
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Why not split ubuntu up? This is not the only difference between the metric and imperial countries. Software patents, DMCA come to mind.
Why not create a 'imperial ubuntu version' without audio and video codecs, without dvd-support and with imperial standards by default.
And lets call the other 'international ubuntu version' with all codecs, with the metric system.
It seems silly how much of the default ubuntu system sucks, just because of 2 countries, representing I dunno, 0,1% of the world?
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Many hardware is not working, suspend under Linux is not working stable (it even freezes for me on a box, where i use only free drivers provided by the kernel)
And you argue about this?!!!
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vilbara
wrote on the 6 Mar 08 at 16:04
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If there is no option to select metric vs. imperial then metric should be the default one.
@Kingoftherings: EU alone has way more people than US.
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edcrypt
wrote on the 6 Mar 08 at 18:39
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Metric == standard. As a Brazilian, I can only agree. +1
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Even NASA now uses the metric system.
The metric system is far superior, only idiots use the other system.
Feet? cmon! plz! lolz
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OK, so here is an idea for brainstorm.usa.com :
* Please use the metric system. (i) it's universal, and (ii) it's much simpler.
And for brainstorm.uk.com :
* Please drive on the right side of the road. Many people kill themselves when they visit your country and drive.
And for brainstorm.france.com :
* Please boil your milk and remove all bacteria before making your cheese. Then it would get this wonderful plastic taste, as in everywhere else in the world.
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I echo the sentiments above. This should not be a matter of "this system is better so set it to default." Address the issue smartly and set the units based on the locale.
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gmlion
wrote on the 8 Mar 08 at 00:05
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@nathan_s
Well, at least it's important not to use BOTH at the same time
[OT]
when I first heard that story I really couldn't believe it was true. I think Lockheed Martins as a sort of Microsoft with its not-standard browser making internet worse
[OT]
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ll
wrote on the 9 Mar 08 at 17:00
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System defaults should be set by the user during install. It should function like the selection of the keyboard. You select your country then out of a list it selects the most likely keyboard you have but you still have to confirm that choice. My point is that it should ask me to confirm or change the units I want to use during install.
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Since Ubuntu is ment to be used throughout the world, it should always use international standards as the default.
If the user during installation selects a physical location (not language!) where a deviance from the standard is the official local standard, the system should use that (provided it is supported).
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I'am agree with the selecction by country. But I think the Live CD should use, by default, the metric system. Because it is created for an International audience.
PS. Excuse my bad English. I'am from Perú.
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Kit
wrote on the 10 Mar 08 at 11:08
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[quote=Ralf.Nieuwenhuijsen]Why not split ubuntu up? This is not the only difference between the metric and imperial countries. Software patents, DMCA come to mind.
Why not create a 'imperial ubuntu version' without audio and video codecs, without dvd-support and with imperial standards by default.
And lets call the other 'international ubuntu version' with all codecs, with the metric system.
It seems silly how much of the default ubuntu system sucks, just because of 2 countries, representing I dunno, 0,1% of the world?[/quote]
QFT
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By country selection (in installer + per-user).
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probono
wrote on the 14 Mar 08 at 03:05
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Maybe this would have increased chances for inclusion if someone created a blueprint for it?
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ll
wrote on the 14 Mar 08 at 21:24
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I don't know how to make a blueprint or where to make it but I did provide a link to a webpage I threw together and said anyone could modify the mock up screen shot. Here is the link again.
http://lklk.awardspace.com/ubuntu.html
Please feel free to modify the image on that page and submit it as a blue print.
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We in Chile use commonly Letter and American Foolscap papers. It would be nice to se an option to choose the kind of paper we would like to use at installation.
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gedeon
wrote on the 19 Mar 08 at 15:46
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+1 on centx comment. As he said, I'd also like those settings be guessed from where I live, but still be able to run the OS in English.
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Endolith
wrote on the 13 Apr 08 at 06:11
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@Bram S
"Great idea, as long as this means we also use the proper notation for bits and bytes in all of the OS. 1 MiB = 1024 KiB = 1048576 Bytes"
Here you go:
http://brainstorm.ubuntu.com/idea/4114/
:)
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Great idea, however you all are forgetting that one of those two countries is the best one in the World. Thus, accomodating Ubuntu to fit us is the obvious path. By the way, soon we'll change Ubuntu's name to Holliwuntu.
:) Just kidding. I don't see why my country won't change to the metric system.
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jpka
wrote on the 25 Jun 08 at 15:46
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+1
inches in OpenOffice not only confusing, but also break
normal indent sizes in paragraphs & tables, when open
msword .doc files.
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fballem
wrote on the 21 Aug 08 at 11:16
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Certain realities:
1. The majority of the world uses the metric system to measure distances and to specify paper size.
2. For those of us in North America, the largest volume of business is with the United States, which uses imperial to measure distances and to specify paper size.
3. Those of us in Canada have the worst of both worlds - we use metric to measure distance and imperial for paper size. Unless of course we are doing drawings that will be used in the US, in which case, the distances will also be imperial.
There may be sensible defaults, but they must be changeable on a system-wide basis. In a perfect world, distance and paper size would be system-wide parameters, accessible to any program, and changeable on a case-by-case basis.
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Endolith
wrote on the 22 Aug 08 at 20:30
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It should ideally set by locale, not just defaulting to one or the other.
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Strange, but I have metric by default :)
I have 8.04, with english lang.
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cubytus
wrote on the 10 Oct 08 at 04:06
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Hello from Canada too, we measure distance in kilometers for the younger generation (the one most likely to use Ubuntu), centimeters for fallen snow, but feet for accumulated snow on the side of the road, and inches for screens (TVs and computers), paper (good luck trying to find just one 500-sheat ream of A4 paper here, although it's possible!). So really.
Paper is imperial size, but ruling on it is metric!
It appears that each country has small quirks with measures, and those must be taken into account. Just defaulting to what the country uses the most commonly, providing the option to change it before applying it. And, of course, system-wide settings (you hear, OOo?)
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bbt
wrote on the 2 Nov 08 at 13:01
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Should be country-specific with option to modify individually
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davourak
wrote on the 22 Nov 08 at 21:22
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Most definitely have everything default to metric. I would even like to have a metric-only distro that had no imperial units in it at all, everything was just in metric, A4 paper size, 24 hour digital clock, etc.
Ubuntu is not American so why does some software default to imperial? And why does the language option default to US English?
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jpcote
wrote on the 9 Dec 08 at 20:17
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No, no, in North american, well here in Canada, we are using the imperial system for printing and the metric system for about everything else. So there is no a4 page available. Every folder and systems are made for letter, legal, tabloid. I'm a graphic designer working always on it.
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Please please no selection by country!!!
This is major pita right now with many systems and applications which mix totally three independent things: language, country you are in and country you are from. This are all different things!
I live in Germany right now. I'm from Belarus. And I use US locale with € sign and metric units. No way you can figure that all out by just asking country I'm in right now.
Also, after working a lot with NA colleagues, I would definitely not set system to use metric units by default. This is just bad idea.
Essentially the idea boils down to /simple/ bug:
- Allow at any time to configure (centrally) regional settings. Settings should be automatically picked up by (running) applications/daemons after user changes them.
As for now I guess I'm stuck with the "PC Load Letter"...
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Endolith
wrote on the 23 Dec 08 at 16:56
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"Please please no selection by country!!!"
Yes, the default selection should be by country. Choosing a single default for all users when you can make a good guess based on their country is bad.
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I have selected Sydney as my time zone and thus most of my time settings are in 12hr am/pm style.
But besides some old folks and during conversation everyone uses 24hr format.
So the 'system default' is 'wrong'
In evolution it is even worse. The mail list view gives me 12hr diplay whearas the mail detail view shows 24hr... wtf!
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ll
wrote on the 6 Apr 09 at 03:37
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It is annoying having the system default to imperial, non metric paper, non ISO 8601 date, and 12 hour clock just because I select USA as my time zone. At least with the keyboard I can choose to use Dvorak right from the installer it would be nice if it where true for the other options at least in an advanced tab like grub install customization is.
I used the 9.04 beta and our demands have been ignored.
If anyone knows how to make a launchpad blueprint please feel free to use this graphic http://lklk.awardspace.com/ubuntu.html
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I have selected Sydney as my time zone and thus most of my time settings are in 12hr am/pm style.
But besides some old folks and during conversation everyone uses 24hr format.
So the 'system default' is 'wrong'
What would you like it to do, read your mind? It should prompt you for your location, provide you with defaults based on that location, and then let you modify them if you don't like them.
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Blueprint ubiquity-units:
